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Wow, NPOV
How much more NPOV can this article get?--68.81.105.166 02:24, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
So NPOV, I am not sure were to start on this one.--Numerousfalx 02:27, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
I just looked at this article myself. I think you guys mean "POV" ;-). As much as I agree with some of what has been said, this article screams point of view. I will ask for it to be reviewed.
The vehicle itself screams "POV"! Note that article does not state that this monstrosity is a fuel sucking, road wreaking, small car crushing pile of wretched excess - it only states rather mildly that some aspects of this vehicle are thought by some groups and persons to be not quite socially acceptable as a means of personal transportation, with appropriate documentation as to the reasons and the basic exploitation of the manufacture of tax loopholes and personal fears. Leonard G. 02:29, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)
- "This , of course, reduces its ground clearance and, consequently, its wall and rock climbing capabilities; which, in any case, appear to be of little actual interest to most purchasers ."
- "Critics point out that the success of this vehicle is largely due to U.S. tax policies for the self-employed (e.g., most dentists, lawyers, and many doctors) , which offer incredible tax write-offs (essentially subsidies for the prosperous) ..."
- " A prosperous and qualifying purchaser of this vehicle may receive subsidies of between USD $30,000 to $40,000 ( paid for by other taxpayers, including those of modest income )..."
- " Ordinary taxpayers receive only a $2000 tax deduction for the Prius..."
- "While some might point to the recent increase in fuel prices as the reason for the demand reduction, this seems unlikely given the economics of the vehicle and the type of buyer likely to purchase it (prosperous and definitely not of a "green" inclination) ."
- "Many casual observers note that these vehicles tend to be driven aggressively in urban environments; most likely due to the characteristics of the buyer rather than the vehicle ."
I cite these examples as pure anger against the buyers of the vehicle. The above are extremely biased and seem to harbor not set-in-stone facts but resentment towards anyone who drives an H2. The author of these supposed facts provided no research citations and made it clear that s/he believes that most, if not all, H2 drivers are rich, aggressive, uncaring and suburban dwellers.
I also request that anyone who wishes to participate or continue participating in this discussion read Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not, particularly the section on "Wikipedia is not a soapbox", especially the section concerning Advocacy of any type. We are not here to make political statements; we are here to provide facts. Linuxbeak 19:15, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)
I'm still getting the feeling that there are editors that are harboring negative feelings towards not only H2 owners but those of higher incomes. Even if this is false, I am asking that everyone please be careful of opinions and wording. Even if you make an edit that is technically completely true, try to remain as far away from either side of the political spectrum as possible. Linuxbeak 18:25, Apr 27, 2005 (UTC)
How can one be a "critic" of a car!? Maybe of the person driving it. But the car? Tfine80 00:47, 27 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Off-Road
Why is this vehicle described as having "tremendous off-road ability"? That is simply not true; it's a Chevy Tahoe underneath and is barely competent anywhere but paved streets and highways.
Fact: Debunking the Tahoe Frame Myth: The final frame assembly is made up of 3 sections. The front uses a modified GM 2500-Series utility frame. The mid-section is all new and is completely boxed. The rear section uses a modifed GM 1500-Series frame which is upgraded for 8000 pound gross vehicle weight. Hart1
I ended up cleaning up the frame bit a bit to provide more clarity. --Beastmaster 18:45, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
Thanks Beastmaster!-HArt1clarification sought
Inconsequential to H2 purchasers, or to purchasers of other vehicles? I think a wording tweak is needed here, but I'm coming up against a wall. – Hajor 22:29, 2 Sep 2004 (UTC)
Hmm - I agree that the last part of the sentance does not follow the first.
Inconsequential to most purchasers of this kind of vehicle - even though highly subsidized by the tax write-offs, it takes a lot of wealth to be in a position to take that advantage - people with wealth who purchase this kind of vehicle could hardly care about the ecological consequences and if they are buying a 14mg (12)vehicle they probably don't care about gasoline prices either.
Perhaps more to the point is that the really "green" and (very) patient people are waiting for Prius's, while the safety concious are turning back to robust sedans, and the SUV types are becoming more practical as far as econonomy of operation and practicallity of parking is concerned. These could be some of the reasons for the fall-off in demand, plus the fact that for (almost) any vechicle there will be some market - perhaps that market for the H2 is simply satiated.
BTW, where are the fans to fill out the "Fans" section? At least the "Critics" section has not yet induced an edit war.
Leonard G. 03:36, 3 Sep 2004 (UTC)
Can we have a reference in the tax subsidies section? I know about the heavy vehicle exemption, but $30k-$40k is a lot of dough. Where does THAT kind of cash come in?--SFoskett 20:17, Sep 3, 2004 (UTC)
By the way - Google.com and www.alltheweb.com - search without quotes "hummer 2 fan site" - kind of like the famous "French military victories" search. Leonard G. 04:56, 7 Sep 2004 (UTC)
Manufacturing location
Needs a fact check, since an anon editor changed location and in a second edit change the manufacturer (apparent confusion between H1 by AG and H2 by GM) Leonard G. 03:51, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Moved POV discussion from article
User:Linuxbeak - Please take all discussions HERE rather than inside the article. That's not the Wikipedia way. --SFoskett 18:48, Jun 8, 2005 (UTC)
Linuxbeak responded positively on my talk page so I will remove the NPOV tag. --SFoskett 20:16, Jun 13, 2005 (UTC)
Fuel economy
What units are presented here ? US or Imperia ? See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miles_per_gallon Kupsztal (talk) 13:11, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
Linuxbeak: If you're going to include "worst case", you need to also include "best case"
The fuel economy article (right now) would be best displayed in a chart form, because the paragraph that it is presently is confusing to look at. If the test company could be shown across from their results, it would be much easier for someone to find information from this site. Thunder215 (talk) 14:13, 4 June 2008 (UTC)Tax benefits
Linuxbeak: This is about the vehicle, not about the people buying the vehicle or the tax bracket that they belong to. Get off the soapbox, please! This is quite blatantly ranting about the system of government and taxation. Stick to the article, and once again get off the soapbox. Cite sources. Suggests that this content comes from Greenpeace or PETA.
Resource use
Linuxbeak: Asks for sources on "aerodynamics of a brick". Requests sources for coefficient of drag figures.
Linuxbeak: Commentary on "its poor fuel efficiency and consequent contributions to global warming and U.S. petroleum problems cause the vehicle to be detested by environmentalists" - "This statement is inherently flawed. It's not like this particular vehicle alone contributes majorly to global warming. Compare the amount of H2s in existance to the amount of cattle that release methane, and I think the cows are going to come out on top. Cite your sources on this one." Once again, an example. I'm asking that you put this into perspective. The H2 alone isn't going to destroy the world.
Wow, NPOV How much more NPOV can this article get?--68.81.105.166 02:24, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)So NPOV, I am not sure were to start on this one.--Numerousfalx 02:27, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
I just looked at this article myself. I think you guys mean "POV" ;-). As much as I agree with some of what has been said, this article screams point of view. I will ask for it to be reviewed.
The vehicle itself screams "POV"! Note that article does not state that this monstrosity is a fuel sucking, road wreaking, small car crushing pile of wretched excess - it only states
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