Vote for inclusion/removal of Death from game addiction reference
I propose (following the rather long debate above) that the references (as there are now 2) regarding Lee Seung Seop and his unfortunate death due to his addiction to computer gaming be removed from this article and only included elsewhere (ie Computer Games or Addiction articles). -Localzuk (talk) 18:55, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
- Delete - nominator vote -Localzuk (talk) 18:55, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
- Delete — Send this to Darwin Awards, it's a petty lame way to die —
- Move - Game addiction is the right place for this. Mushroom 19:10, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
- Keep - It violates no wikipedia policy and that's all we have to go by. It is consistent with the manner of how many many other articles are written.
And Rebuke - Also, making a decision via this voting process is against the policy. Policy, guidelines, and widespread practice cannot be circumvented by invoking a local majority on a particular article. I suspect we went to voting because the nominator didn't find any policy, guidelines, or practice to back his side up.David Bergan 19:19, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
- Comment . My personal opinion is that the death probably wasn't really relevant to StarCraft in particular, so it does not really belong in this article. However, I don't think it would hurt anyone to keep the info in the article (as a general principle, I prefer keeping information to discarding information). Let the readers decide what to make of it; it's a fact that the guy died playing StarCraft (no one said it was specifically because of StarCraft), so let's mention it and let people draw their own conclusions. If you really can't stand the idea of having such an odd fact in the article, take it to Requests for Comment, so we can get input from a large number of people, as opposed to only a few regular editors on this page. Phil s 19:55, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
- Keep This death distinguishes Starcraft from other games. Much like the elite gamers who are discussed in this article, Mr. Lee is an established part of popular Starcraft legacy.
- Delete . The fact that people get addicted to video games is fairly universal, and not really appropriate for a discussion of this video game in particular. His story isn't any more relevant than anyone else's, it's just a bit of media folklore I'm not sure belongs here. Even the Everquest article doesn't talk about specific people who died playing the game, it just references addiction in general.--BigCow 03:00, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
- Move Clearly belongs in another article, namely gaming addiction. Dali 04:59, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
- Move Move it to the video game controversies page. He died playing StarCraft, but such a person could have died playing any other video game. Unless someone has evidence that StarCraft is more addictive than other games, I don't see it as a StarCraft issue. I suppose a link to the video game controversy page is fine, though. Someone looking for information on Mr. Lee might visit the StarCraft page first. Kimera757 19:43, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
- Move As per what Kimera said. bob rulz 07:59, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
- Move to game addiction. If he didn't have a copy of SC he'd have just died while playing something else. And in answer to Ryan Utt, I don't think it's common to die of video game addiction, but video game addiction itself is not that rare. It generally isn't linked to one specific game the addict owns, so I don't think it's really about Starcraft. -Kasreyn 12:03, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
- Keep . It's clear this guy was addicted to SC. Notable and needs to be included. Gflores Talk 22:17, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
- Move It belongs in the gaming addiction article.
Death from gaming a hoax?
I have just done a bit of research and this article about sums up what I have found:. Is it a hoax or re-creation of an old story? Can we find out any more about it? -Localzuk (talk) 18:46, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
Unsourced sentence
In the 'Multiplayer' section there is the sentence Some players dislike what have come to be called "money-maps", claiming that they change the game in negative ways, though others embrace the new style as another facet of a massive online gaming universe. I have re-added requests for citations on the 2 points (that some people dislike it and some like it).
I will remove the entire sentence unless citations for this claims are presented within a week or so. -Localzuk (talk) 00:04, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
Before we get into a what-WP-is-not debate, I'd like to remind everyone exactly what we're talking about:
"Some players dislike what have come to be called "money-maps", claiming that they change the game in negative ways, though others embrace the new style as another facet of a massive online gaming universe."
I, personally, just don't like the sentence. It contains a grain of truth, but in a very lame way: True, many people (me among them) think playing money maps is destructive to one's skill, but even those people often admit money maps are "fun once in a while". Whether the game is better on money maps or not is not the point. The people I know don't play money maps because they value their level of proficiency, not because money maps "change the game in negative ways." --Chodorkovskiy 11:48, 4 April 2006 (UTC)
Relations to Ender's Game
Just a thought. I always thought the idea behind starcraft was based off the book Ender's Game by Orson Scott Card. Does anyone know anything about this or is that a false rumor. The preceding comment was originally added by 12.33.52.253.
Ender's Game is related to SC only in the fact that both deal with an inter-stellar war and bug-like creatures. The idea might as well have been taken from Starship Troopers or The Forever War. Regardless, this is pure speculation. --Chodorkovskiy 08:09, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
- Starcraft would make a good book look at Libertys crusade Ender might make a good game but I think the simialarites would be closer with the Yuuzhan Vong than Enders.
Regarding famous Korean players
This comment is directed to Nandesuka. I've left out some of the less-famous ones you removed, but I've reinserted Boxer and Iloveoov as examples. I don't know if you're a SC player or not, and as an editor it shouldn't matter, but I used to play a great deal on Battle.net and talked to a lot of Korean players. As near as I can determine, some Korean Starcraft players have the level of fame in their home country that in America is accorded to MVP's in the NBA and NFL. They are hugely popular, and hold exhibition games in large stadiums, where the game is projected onto a giant screen for tens of thousands of spectators, complete with commentary from other famous or not-so-famous players. The phenomenon differs from the NFL only in that it is a mental rather than physical competition (and also, perhaps, in a smaller amount of marketing and product endorsement deals :P) To my mind this makes the inclusion of famous Korean players completely compatable with Wikipedia's notability policy.
With that in mind, I think it's entirely appropriate to list and link to a few of the most famous Korean SC players, just as the article on the NFL links to articles on famous American Football players. To do otherwise is to unfairly treat Starcraft as if it's somehow "less important" than football, which would be inserting a structural bias into Wikipedia. It would be a silent POV that "some" sports are good enough that their players can be named, and "other" sports are not. It's not our place to make that judgement.
Respectfully, Kasreyn 21:12, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
Uh, Im Yo Hwan - or BoxeR - is recognized across the entire world among anyone into competitive gaming. And if you play starcraft at a remotely competitive level, you know who he is, it's just that simple.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lim_Yo_Hwan http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iloveoov
-JonathanWalsh 00:35, 24 August 2006 (UTC)
Serious Vandalism
Wow, someone really did a number on the opening paragraph. I'll do my best to fix it, but it won't likely be perfect. {Master Deusoma 04:23, 3 May 2006 (UTC)}
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